Episode Transcript
[00:00:27] Speaker A: Good evening, everyone, and welcome to the Trim radio network and Life walk with Christ God. You come on over to the Trim radio network where you can listen in. We broadcast live all over the world. You could buy merchandise, which helps us stay on the air. And if you want to be a part of our trim radio network team, all you have to do is message us. It's that easy. We'll show you how easy it is. Anyway, the opinions expressed by my host, co host, guests, myself and others is not necessarily that of the trim radio network, its owners, managers or others. And any information shared by us is not to be considered advice. We inform, we don't advise. And that includes all and any legal, medical or professional information as well. We have a call in number 803-866-1667 and this song right here. Well, I'll tell you what, holy water. And that's an absolutely fantastic song. It's got Jordan, please, in it. Colton Dixon, unspoken and more. And I'll tell you what, that is covered under our BMI music license. Six 1516 58. And without further ado, I have a guest tonight, and I wanted to bring him on because I value his opinion so much and it absolutely means the world to me. So we are going to. Instead of going into the book of John, where I had let off, we're going to be kind of delving around a little bit. But my biggest thing was I have been kind of interested in talking about how do we prove God's existence?
How can we as human beings prove, how can we in this world prove God's existence? And the more I thought about it, and I not only read the Bible, and I read it every day, and we do our Bible app and we read. And I've taken online courses.
Here we go.
And we have successfully finished the courses, ancient Christianity and the Genesis story, which was wonderful, the narratives there, and also C. S. Lewis, which, very devout Christian. And we're in the middle of that one. But it occurred to me, how do we prove Christ God's existence? And what is our moral obligation to this world? And does that help us prove Christ God's existence? And with me tonight is Mr. Riscala, Stephen from take point or from Red Pill reality show, and him. And we. I get time to do his shows and he's volunteered to come on and do mine, which is a great boon for me. So, Riscala, what do you think about a question like that?
[00:03:41] Speaker B: Definitely a challenge.
Well, I don't even have words to properly describe how I would feel, how I feel about all of that.
It is definitely a challenge. I mean, that's the best way I can put it.
However, be that as it may, we have things that happen around us, so many different things that happen around us, that it would be trying to think of the right word to properly describe this. It would be disrespectful, I think.
So your question is, how can we prove there's a God? Is that correct?
[00:04:28] Speaker A: What we're doing is we're putting God on trial. And this is something that I've told Sherry about, and she actually bought me a video recorder because I'm going to write about a lot of this. And as to how we can definitely prove not only God's existence where I put him on trial, because for me, that's exactly what we do every day in this world, with the events that happen, between politics, between everything else that happens, the wars and everything else. Are we not putting Christ God on trial? And if that doesn't give you a little hint, because you noticed I said Christ God there in my mind, I've already put him on trial, but I want to do it for the benefit of listeners, to get a thought process of how they feel about it. And we do have a call in number 803-866-1667 and the question is, we're putting God on trial right now.
How do we prove Christ God's existence?
[00:05:35] Speaker B: One of the ways I would do it is my first question would be, do you believe in intelligent design? Do you believe that everything that goes on around us has been designed by some intelligent being of some sort?
[00:05:52] Speaker A: Okay, so the question would be, for us, in order for us, because we have understanding, we have emotions, be it reasonable or unreasonable. And in this case, we'll use reasonable, because C. S. Lewis also has it in there.
He likes to refer to everything back to the Tao Tao, which is that you have a moral obligation regardless of religion or not. Doesn't matter what religion. Protestant, Lutheran, Catholic, Christian, atheism, theist, whatever, there is some type of moral obligation in the world. Now. If there's not, then you become subjective.
A perfect example would be two people getting on a bus, and all of a sudden there's the last seat on the bus, and one slides in a little faster than the other, and one of them looks at the other one and says, that's my seat.
Who's right? Who's wrong?
What would be the perspective of that, of who's right and who's wrong?
And what then becomes the moral obligation? And I loved C. S. Lewis's explanation to this and what would you think that would be?
[00:07:29] Speaker B: So what does he have to say?
[00:07:31] Speaker A: So the answer to this is if he says, no, this is my seat. I got here first. Well, I was sitting down and you slid right underneath me and I almost sat on your lap.
Well, the bigger guy could surely punch the smaller guy, as C. S. Lewis says in the face.
However, one would say to the other, maybe let's be reasonable, let's talk about this.
So if they would come to that before it would come to blows, then we know that there is some type of a moral, regardless of who you are. Let's say one was an atheist and one was a Christian.
Okay? There would still be some regard for some type of moral obligation or standing within the world. Regardless, how do you know? The atheist might be able to turn around and say, you know what, it's not worth the argument.
Go ahead, take the seat. The Christian might turn around and say, you know what, that's okay, my brother, go ahead, you need that seat.
And hopefully they wouldn't come to blows, right? Or we wouldn't have that argument. But you could see the morality in there because the other people that are on the bus too are going to witness this.
So it's not just a matter of power because if they're both of equal size or even if one's bigger than the other, one will look like a complete bully, which will then any standing he has on the community of that bus is going to change about him. Right.
And if one is scrawny and can't defend himself or therefore gives up and gives up the seat, wouldn't he be then okay, there's the bigger man. He gave up the seat.
Or is he the scared guy and chicken? You see, there is some type of a moral standing regardless of what you believe, what you don't believe.
And therefore if there is a moral obligation in this world of right and wrong, then there has to be a being that decides what that justice is that gives that rule, wouldn't there?
[00:10:13] Speaker B: It would seem logical.
[00:10:15] Speaker A: That would be the reasonable part, right? That would seem reasonable.
So therefore now we have not only the morals and the moral obligation to each other in this world, but we also know there is a person who leads that and it can't be more than one because the ultimate justice is decided by what you can have a jury on a trial decide. But really in the end, who makes the ultimate justice on that? There's a judge.
He can override the jury.
[00:11:00] Speaker B: I agree.
[00:11:03] Speaker A: So in that understanding, now if that's Cs Lewis's. Look at it in the Tao, then wouldn't that apply to Christianity? The difference is this. You have myths, let's say, and we studied this one last night, let's use greek gods.
Let's use Zeus, a high God, right? And then we have hades. Then we have Poseidon. Then we have other gods. Right, but you still have one high God, Zeus. Correct.
My question is, these are myths. They're not necessarily proven gods. They're story gods.
In the Bible we have what are facts. These things happened and took place.
Timelines were written, scrolls, artifacts and everything else.
So while we put God on trial, one of the things that we have is we have a difference between there's the myth and the myth, and that could have two different types of meanings.
So we don't look at everything, don't look at it as philosophical or look at the theology part of it, right? Let's look at it as the myth itself about Christ, God, the smoke from out of the mountains when the fire. They saw the fire. And as they came out of Egypt, they said, you talk to him, Moses.
We're afraid of him.
You talk to him because we don't want to be consumed.
And God knew this and he saw, okay, that was good. They fear me, which is a good thing, because in the end, he is the justice. He is the righteous.
Do we know his righteousness is for good? Well, we know that by not only the character and what he has displayed throughout history, but we also know he is just.
Even if we see in our minds that sometimes he's unjust.
Now we know back when he was going to flood the world with Moses and then he was sorry he made man.
He regretted it and said so, said as much.
Because man had free will and man was corrupt and man became evil.
He could have made a world to where there was no free will and everyone would just have to do everything that he said.
[00:14:12] Speaker B: Sometimes I think it would be easier that way.
[00:14:15] Speaker A: Right, exactly. And you could see now why, if God is perfect, and yet he says in the Bible that he regrets making mankind.
Where does that perfectness go?
And is it that he made mankind imperfect? Or was it the free will part, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil?
You have all the trees in the garden, and we know this, all of them. The tree of life, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and all the other trees.
And we know the serpents in there. And again, open to interpretation, exactly. What is the serpent and what does he look like?
We know he wasn't crawling on the ground, yet on his belly, because he did that afterward, after he was punished from God. Now you will crawl on your belly and eat dust.
So what is the definition of the serpent? It's the same thing. We all envisioned an apple, but it doesn't say apple, it says fruit.
And along with all this, we also have inner relationships, human to human relationships and human to divinity relationships.
And we've doing these courses. This is one of the very interesting things because it gives you a whole different perspective, which made me think, okay, if we put God on trial, I am trying to prove God exists so we know the things that happen. We know after the serpent was crafty, he sat there to Eve and he said, surely God didn't tell you you couldn't eat the fruit of the garden.
And she corrected him right away. And no, no, we could eat all the fruit of the garden.
We are just not to eat the fruit of the tree of good and of knowledge of good and evil, or touch it, or surely we will die. And then the serpent turns and says, surely you will not die.
You will become like gods.
Your eyes will be opened.
So could God be talking about that? Part of I regret making man because it all started from there, when in reality it really had started in heaven before then, because we already know God had already said, you've got to go, Satan.
You want worship to come to you and power to come to you and not through you to me. So there's war going on.
[00:17:31] Speaker B: Exactly. There was a war already happening. That's right.
[00:17:35] Speaker A: Still happening. And we know it's not just heaven. It says all the way through the Old Testament, all the way up in the New Testament, we get the revelations and it changes heavenly realms.
What exactly does that mean?
Layers?
Is it layers? Is it different areas?
There's so much that we didn't know. And in the very beginning of Genesis, he created man and woman.
And then it says he created Adam.
So who was already here? Well, we're finding out the Nephilim.
[00:18:22] Speaker B: A.
[00:18:23] Speaker A: Lot of it is if it was already created and all the plants were already there.
And then it says later on in Genesis, well, the plants haven't grown yet because God had not created the rains, but it uses everything in plural.
So there are some discrepancies that you look at, but they can be brought, made to sense.
And what we do know is when God had placed Adam, molded him like clay, breathed into his nostrils and placed him into Eden, he was in there to do a couple of things, not only tend the garden, but guard it, protect it, make it grow. You know what I mean?
And we also know God is perfect. But he says in Genesis, adam's loneliness was not good.
Hence he put Adam to sleep, opened up, took a rib out, and thus made eve. And Eve was to be a help meat, not a servant, not a slave, but a help meat for Adam.
Now, after they ate this fruit, here's something that happens.
Three relationships were ruined. Can you guess which ones were ruined on this? Just from reading Genesis, can you guess which ones were ruined?
[00:20:07] Speaker B: I'm listening.
[00:20:10] Speaker A: So God comes back down after they've eaten the fruit. And of course, right away, Adam and Eve realized they're naked.
So they sewed together some fig trees, right, and covered each other up. And God is there, you know, God knows exactly where Adam and Eve are, and he's calling out to Adam, where are you?
The question, where are you?
Brings up a great point of is God asking this question to get some type of repentance because you already know exactly what happened.
And he says, hey, we're over here. We're hiding because we're naked. Well, who told you you were naked?
How did you know you were naked? Did you eat from the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil?
And here's where Adam, this is exactly where you're going to see now. These relationships happen. You have divinity asking Adam this question. And Adam turning around, the woman who you gave me gave me fruit of it, and I did eat.
So now we have a rupture of the relationship there not only of God to Adam, but Adam to eve also, because he threw her under the bus, he blamed her.
And when he goes back and he asks her, and she said, the serpent beguiled me.
So now there's the other part.
The last part is the rupture of man and evil at that part, too, because you have to include that also.
Let's face it, the serpent wasn't good.
We know this, right? We see this every day. It's going on in our world today.
But Adam hurts his relationship with God because he turns around and he blames God. Well, the woman who you gave to me, she gave me fruit and I ate of it. Had you not given her to me, this would have never happened.
So then he goes to her, what have you done?
The serpent beguiled me right away. She throws a serpent under the bus, rightfully so, but she failed to follow a simple commandment too.
So the relationship is broken there. So what did God do out of his mercy was throw Adam and Eve out of Eden.
And then he put a cherubim there to make sure that they could not come back or eat from the tree of life.
Certainly they didn't want them to live forever. Which brings the next question.
Was man intentionally supposed to be able to eat from the tree of life, which would give him immortality?
[00:23:52] Speaker B: I think that it's just my opinion, when God made man in his image, and God is eternal, I think that he had, along with the image, that if man had never fallen, that he would just basically live on and on and on, that the failure, this knowledge of good and evil.
The Bible says that the satan or the snake, or however you want to refer to him, beguiled her. See, I think that was a sexual act. I don't think it was like an apple on a tree. You see so much of this characterized as an apple on a tree. I don't think it was an apple on a tree as much as it was a sexual act that neither one of them was familiar with. And then once one of them was introduced to it, their eyes were open. Oh, my gosh.
It's like children. You can have children two and three and four years old running around naked. They don't care. They don't know any better. But then if somebody abuses them sexually abuses them, then their eyes are open.
[00:24:57] Speaker A: Exactly. Or not even that. But do children sin?
[00:25:08] Speaker B: I think it's an observation of the heart.
[00:25:13] Speaker A: A morality.
[00:25:15] Speaker B: Not so much morality as it is. If it's a child, for example, and you say, do children sin? If the child did something they didn't know any better, would that be a sin? If they didn't know any better, how can that be a sin? Nobody told them.
[00:25:31] Speaker A: So if the child is told he can't have a chocolate bar, and he throws a temper tantrum and a fit, and he starts throwing something, or he starts hitting or biting or spitting or anything else.
Is it because he doesn't know any better?
[00:25:54] Speaker B: Again, it depends on the age. But in some cases, yes, they don't know any better.
[00:25:58] Speaker A: But then how would they?
When a child gets hungry, it cries. We know this has a dirty diaper. It's going to cry. It's uncomfortable, right? It's uncomfortable.
But when it doesn't get its way and it does that, where exactly are they learning that if they have not been around other children?
[00:26:22] Speaker B: Well, again, it goes back to my point being that they didn't know any better at the time. They didn't know what naked was.
Again, it's like children running around. They don't care if your privates are showing or not. That's not where their mind is at. But once they're introduced to that, then their eyes are open, so to say, and they're going to act differently when they see something like that.
I think what happened in the garden was that Satan introduced them to sex.
And I think that really was the falling away, because I don't think that God was intended for them. I'm just second guessing here. It's easy to do.
I think maybe he didn't intend for them to have offspring and sex wasn't. Maybe he realized that if the sex got involved in the act of living, how it can complicate things and really bring in all kinds of issues.
[00:27:34] Speaker A: Which then brings up another point, then why advance a reproductive system?
[00:27:44] Speaker B: Good point. Okay, again, in the creation of man as he created man in an image of himself, maybe there's something that if he created all of the rest of creation procreates, then it's like, maybe it's the standard operational procedure. I don't know if that's correct.
[00:28:11] Speaker A: We know that there were animals, right? God created the animals, but he had Adam in not so many words, participate in creation, didn't he not?
[00:28:26] Speaker B: He had him. What? Say that again.
[00:28:27] Speaker A: He had him participate in creation.
[00:28:30] Speaker B: In a way, he had him name all the animals.
[00:28:34] Speaker A: That's right. Which is an act of participating. Here, I've made this. You give it a name. Whatever name you give it, that's what it'll be.
That's whatever it will be from here on in. That's a cow. That's a cattle.
Now I made it.
But he's naming it. So he's therefore participating, so to speak. That divinity to humanity relationship was strong there.
That's how much he loved Adam.
It was strong there that he let him. Okay, you name it. And then even when it came to Eve, this is flesh of my flesh. This is bone of my bone.
She shall be called woman, for he was man, and then it's woman.
There's so many great elements to this, and we see it go throughout the Bible. I think that the fruit, whatever that fruit may be, you have your thought on that.
The fruit is what opened eyes to lust, greed, power per se. Because isn't that what and what sold Eve and Adam was the fact you will be like gods.
[00:30:13] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:30:16] Speaker A: So a selling point.
So Adam had a moral responsibility.
Eve had a moral responsibility.
And they had a giver of that responsibility, God.
Which thus then proves, again, not through myth, but through stories, but actually through facts, places and events, which is different. So it's only reasonable to think that just in those few instances that God exists.
And then as we trip alongward and we get into Abraham and God wakes him up and says, abraham Hanini, which means I am here.
And he says, you're going to go to Mount Mori and you're going to take Isaac with you and you're going to sacrifice him for me. To me now, just a few pages before he's telling him, well, here you go. Rebecca's going to bear this child, I believe, was it? No, Sarai is going to bear a child. And of course, they were up in age.
And he says, you know what?
He's going to have kingdoms, power, people below him.
So he goes up to the mountain and he cut his own firewood. They carried it along.
He's got his knife with him.
And they run into their obstacles along the way. And when they get there, Isaac, we know guessing from the age and everything else was probably in his very early thirty s, at least according to the videos that we've seen. And from what we're guessing, he wasn't a young man.
He was a young man, but not a young, young man.
And he says, we have nothing to sacrifice. Well, God will provide. And then he gets there and he says, you are the sacrifice.
And Isaac was smart enough to say, okay, he's not fighting Abraham.
Abraham binds his hands.
He's not having to beat him up to bind his hands. That's his son. He loves him.
So Isaac is going there, probably thinking, my life is going to end. And Abraham's going there questioning, thinking to himself, but if he is going to be a ruler over many and a ruler over peoples over many, then maybe God will bring him back to life.
So I have to have faith in God to sacrifice him.
And before it happens, all of a sudden, here comes the angel.
Abraham.
Abraham. Don't touch the lad.
Don't touch him.
And God tells him, because you have been faithful. And I saw you were ready to do this.
Now you will prosper.
But we see these things that make it hard for us to understand. Not only understand God, but, and we say, is God imperfect? He's regretted making man.
Was it a mistake putting the tree of knowledge of good and evil in the garden? Was it an even worse mistake putting the serpent there?
Lots of questions, a lot of questions.
But everything comes to an answer. And then we see the brothers, too. Don't forget with Adam and Eve, the moral obligation that I go back to as we put God on trial, why was Cain able to kill. Why was Cain able to kill Abel?
And for what reason?
And we know because God didn't like the offering that Cain gave versus the offering that Abel gave.
And even looked at him, Cain, why are you so downtrodden? Why are you look so sad about this?
Surely if you give me an offering that is from your heart, not just you're giving me an offering, but where is it coming from?
Is it wholeheartedly what you want when you look at Abel? Abel was a good, God following man.
His was wholeheartedly the best of the best. And the reasons that he gave, we don't know what Cain's reasons were, but we know it was enough that he became jealous of Abel and struck him down.
And then God asked him, and he said, now, remember, these are the two sons. And here's another part in the Bible which is going to be troubling for many people. And when he struck him down and God said, why is the ground blood calling up from the ground of your brother?
So he punishes him.
He punishes him, and he banishes him from the land. Now, you're going to walk through all over the world or whatever and places, and you cannot come back here. I will not be with you.
And then Cain turns around. This burden is too much for me. And if I go on out there, surely people will kill me.
So there were people there, but who were they?
And he said, I will put a mark that if anyone harms you, they will pay sevenfold from me.
[00:37:41] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:37:43] Speaker A: It's very interesting.
And even as we go through further and again, you can go to so many different areas in the Bible to where we have these things of.
Well, first of all, you could see almost everything has brotherly rivalries, and all these different things are happening.
You know this. With Joseph and his brothers, Leah has all these other children.
And Rachel, who Jacob wanted to be with from the beginning, was tricked by habab and tricked and had Leah go in. So he consummated who he thought he was marrying Rachel, and it was.
It ended up being Leah.
So she has children, and, of course, Rachel has two, Joseph and Benjamin.
Now we're seeing a timeline, too. We have a timeline that is being made all the way down the line.
[00:39:02] Speaker B: And that purpose of the timeline is for the identification of the Messiah that's coming down the pike, so to speak.
[00:39:10] Speaker A: The timeline is also exactly where. Okay, here is the beginning part of what we've recorded.
Whether it's to say it's from the absolute beginning, I don't think that we know everything we know, Adam and Eve, we know the Garden of Eden. We know that there was heaven and war before, because the serpent shouldn't have been there, right? So we know something happened.
We know there were other people, men and women, and we were trying to figure out all this. But this is where the mysteriousness, the mystique of the Bible is. And we know. Okay, after this, then here we go. Now we're at Abraham, who has Isaac, and Isaac has who? Well, Esau and Jacob.
And of course, they're wrestling inside of their mother, fighting the whole time.
And when Isaac comes out first, Harry armed like a gorilla, so to speak, and Jacob comes out, he's hanging on to his ankle.
And as we go down, that story between those two, we know that basically Isaac comes back from a hunt. He's famished, starving hungry. And he sees Jacob in there. He's making lentil soup. Give me soup. Surely I'm about to die. Give me some soup. Give me your birthright.
And of course, Isaac didn't really pay too much attention to that, did he? But the birthright is that blessing. The firstborn. The blessing of the firstborn.
Esau says, sure, and he eats the soup and then he goes off. Did he really pay any attention to it?
And we know Jacob. Jacob was kind of shady. He's mischievous, but yet he turned out to be one of the greatest.
He has a change of heart. Well, this happens all the way down the line with Joseph and his brothers, Reuben and all of them, and Judah and the relationship with Benjamin. Jacob is not acknowledging anything about Leah's kids.
When he thinks that he's lost Joseph, he is only, oh, my know, my one son, they couldn't console him. All his daughters, all the kids are together. No, they couldn't console him. Okay, he has lost his son.
Of course he has Benjamin. And then he tells him again. So you see the favoritism, the hierarchy.
And with Benjamin, he's like, listen, I'm not going to send him to Egypt.
At least something should happen to him. You will bring me down and kill me.
But we've seen this all the way through every part of the Bible, basically.
But you see that reconciliation also, that goes on. So there's a lot of moral obligations that make me believe throughout it all, because really, Ruben being, and I believe it is Ruben being the oldest one, the oldest brother was trying to find. He slept with one of the concubine of Jacob, so he fell out of good graces.
And of course, when they were preparing to kill Joseph, the brothers were because of dreams that he had, where basically his dreams. You have to look at it as you're reading it. Was he needling his brother, saying, oh, yeah, I'm a reed. And all of a sudden, yours were all bent over. You were bowing down to me. Surely you think you're going to rule over us.
We're going to bow to you. You're going to rule over us, and we're slaves to you.
He was having visions.
And you come to learn later on, as you look at the interpretation of it, is he didn't know how to read those visions. He was just telling his brothers about the dreams. But they hated him because his father always had him looking over his brother's shoulders, making sure they're tending the crops and whether he was going to give a good report or a bad report to him, which made them hate him so much so that they threw him into a pit.
Eminex ended up turning around, selling him over to the Egyptians, to Pharaoh, the king of the guard, and he's putting.
[00:44:24] Speaker B: Sold him into slavery.
[00:44:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:44:28] Speaker B: I think part of that also was they saw that his dad had favor over Jacob. Favor.
I don't know if this comes out right. Favor more so than the rest of them. He favored Jacob above them, if that makes sense.
[00:44:45] Speaker A: Jacob favored Joseph and Benjamin above all of Leah's kids because he really, truly loved Rebecca. And remember, he had a problem with the father in law. He had a problem with him. He worked for him for 20 years, and in the end, he took some kids and cows and all of some of the lot and left.
He had a problem with him, and he said, listen, I did 20 years of service for you.
So he had that going on. Plus, he was dealing. Jacob was still dealing with Esau. Esau is coming.
And with him 400, which was not really that there were 400 people with him, but 400 says there's a military army. It was regarded as a military unit, an army or whatever it signifies, a military type company.
And Esau is coming, and he's thinking to himself, oh, boy, I remember mother telling me to run off and go to her brother in Heban and stay there until Esau comes down.
And he had already tricked his brother not only out of his birthright, but he had tricked his father, Isaac, by dressing up like Esau with a woolly coat and hands and presenting himself that way. So he ended up getting the blessing. It was really JaCoB that got the blessing when it should have been EsAu.
So EsAu is really mad at him at that point. You see what I'm saying. So now he's contending with that. He's contending with the Kids. He's contending with the Two Wives. He's contending with the father in law. He's contending with EsAu. And, of course, he's offering all these gifts to EsAu. And then he splits his camp up.
He says, okay, the servants will go first. Then I'm going to put Leah and the children there, and Rebecca and I will be in the back, so that if he does come to kill us, some of us will get away.
And, of course, when they're crossing over the river to get to okay, or crossing over Jordan to go where they were going, something interesting happens. In the middle of the night, JacoB wrestles with a man all night long.
And come dawn, he says, okay, let me go.
And he says, I will not let you go unless you bless me.
He's got all these worries on his head. I'm not letting you go unless you bless me. It doesn't say who he wrestled with, but they call the Place panini. And here it is. It says, I have wrestled with God face to face, and I am still alive. I have come out alive. But it could have been angel. But we know at that point that the angel touched or whoever touched Jacob's hip and put it out of socket.
So now he's walking with the limp, and he's got to go meet EsAu.
So now you can imagine Esau being tricked by JaCoB. JacoB has tricked people all his life. He's done all these things.
There's no moral accountability.
And then all of a sudden, he ends up in a wrestling match, and after his hip is out of joint, and he, you know, I'm not. Don't letting you go until you bless me. Because the man saw that he did not prevail over Jacob.
And he said, what is your name? He says, my name is Jacob. You shall no more be called Jacob. You should be called Israel.
So he changes his name. So Jacob is now Israel, and now he still has to go meet Esau.
So to make it right, he sends these flocks and all these gifts and everything over. And he says, hey, hopefully my brother will see good and tell him. And he calls himself servant.
And Esau, Lord Esau didn't even worry about that. He was just happy to see his brother. Matter of fact, he ran over to him and jumped on him and started kissing his neck. He said, what is all this? Who are all these people?
And he still puts himself below Esau.
So there must have been some type of repentance there for him, right?
For the things that he did wrong.
[00:50:03] Speaker B: I would agree.
[00:50:11] Speaker A: Did I lose here? You know, there had to be something. That's what I'm saying. In this world today, there is a moral obligation. And the problem is, our problem, I think right now is we already know what we did to Christ. We killed him and he sacrificed himself for us, for our sins. Because no matter what, not one of us, not one is going to come close enough to God. We all fall short. It's only through Christ that we get close. So when we look at it today, the problem is that we don't have one part of that. We have what we are supposed to know. What is that moral obligation to do what's right. But we don't always see that. Look at Kenneth Copeland.
[00:51:03] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:51:04] Speaker A: Look at some of these other preachers. Joel Osteen, who wouldn't even open the church during the hurricane.
[00:51:12] Speaker B: Look, it's something about some of these guys.
I want them in my mind. Maybe it is Copeland who was talking to somebody about how God had told him he's to have these jets. I think that was him that was saying that. And the look on his face is just like so demonic. It's, oh, my gosh.
And you've got people in your church that are hurting badly financially, but you're buying.
I think it was Copeland. He was talking about how he got such a great deal on an aircraft and somebody sold it to him for pennies on the dollar or something.
[00:51:46] Speaker A: I don't know.
[00:51:47] Speaker B: But I was thinking to myself, the whole time I'm watching this, I'm going, dude, you got all kinds of. We already got one aircraft, I think one or two at that point. What do you need another aircraft for? What's the point of that? Why aren't you helping the people that help you get to where you are? Instead, they turned their back.
The other guy you've just mentioned, my mind just went blank. I see his face. I can't think of his name. He's out there in Texas, I think.
[00:52:12] Speaker A: Olstein.
[00:52:13] Speaker B: Olstein.
Here's a guy who has a megachurch, has all kinds of money, and when the time came that the church was needed, he literally turned his back on people. Literally. And people still support this guy. It's amazing. Truly.
[00:52:30] Speaker A: Slam the doors on it. Slam the doors on.
[00:52:36] Speaker B: It.
[00:52:36] Speaker A: And that's what I'm saying.
Morality is not.
Morality in itself exists.
The problem that we have is, and exactly why I wanted to get you on today is we're putting God on trial because of what we're seeing now.
Where is the justice now? Right? That's the first thing that we ask.
It's the first thing that we ask what is right, what is wrong.
But he has given even through the whole entire Genesis. If you go to Genesis, you go to Exodus. I don't care Leviticus or deuteronomy. Leviticus. You go through all of them every single time. Even in the presence of God, the Israelites still disobeyed him to the point it was more than 20 times that I could just. That's just a roundabout number. It was way more.
It was way more. And that was even in the presence of God, who gives us the moral responsibility, who instills it upon us.
And here we are today.
How do we prove the existence of Christ God?
This is where the trial part begins.
And then we have to look at each other and do you, why do you, Riskella, believe in Christ God?
[00:54:31] Speaker B: I don't look at it as I believe. I know. It's like, do you believe you had parents or did you know you have parents?
So I don't look at it as believing. I know there's just something in my core.
I've been in the electronics industry for 30 some OD years and built my first computer in 1987. So I've been around computers quite a few. Quite a few years. And one of the things I learned about computers is that you put garbage in a computer, you get garbage back out. So we are biological computers. If you put garbage in this computer, you're going to get garbage back out. I go back to something within my. Like, there's software and there's firmware. Your computer has firmware that's not easily maneuverable. I can't think of the right word.
The firmware, you really can't change. You can if you go through a lot of. But it's basically burned in as part of the application for you to run your software. And in my firmware and my biological firmware, I know. I don't believe. I know that a man by the name of Yeshua or Yeshua or Jesus, that a man was on this planet and did some miraculous things, and that man was here by divine intervention. He was not born of just a simple human being. He was born of the spirit as well as he was born of physicality. And that man lived his life in the sense of a price for all the wrongs that have been done on this place against a God who was merciful and forgiving.
However, he had reached a point where things had gotten to such a level of corruption that the only way he could see being able to balance it back out was to give his only son that the birth of Christ in and of itself was intervine.
I'm losing my tongue here.
I can't think of the word now.
Divine intervention, there's no question in my mind. So it's not a matter of me believing, it's, I know, I know that. I know that.
[00:57:04] Speaker A: I know and see that.
It's funny how you put that. So this would be reasonable for me to say, okay, I agree with you. Built like computers, I'm hardware, I have some software in me. The firmware updates me through life.
That firmware that is updated as it updates programs has taught me along the way, not only from my moral responsibility and observations to come to the conclusion, through all reasonable doubt and reasonable proof, that there is one who has given that reason, one who has given those commandments, one that has given those obedience that we're supposed to follow not only from the update of the firmware, but from what I've experienced too, would that be reasonable to say? Yeah, and it's interesting because really, when you look at it, and let's not look at it philosophical wise, God came to earth and killed God for mankind so that mankind could be closer to God, be forgiven.
Because remember, the Trinity is the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit.
Well, the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit are three in one.
It's, it's an outside look at what really happened. But that is exactly what happened.
God sent his one and only begotten son.
But you have to remember in the Bible, it says too, in all things, he gave him all the powers. And everything my father gives to me, I worship and give him all the glory.
So t is God. God is him. If you don't know my father, you don't know me. If you don't know me, you surely don't know my father.
[00:59:50] Speaker B: Amen.
[00:59:52] Speaker A: So when you look at it, that sense, that's exactly what happened.
But we weren't there, though. But we know what happened because we see the proof of it, we see the evidence of it, we see the artifacts of it, we see the scriptures, the apostles of it, epistles of it, we know the apostles.
We see everything to where not only from the divinity to humanity relationship and the human to human relationship, where we were the ones that always fail and not God.
And we look at all these things and say, okay, here we are. Here we are in today's world.
But for me, there are certain things you have to have in your life at some point.
I got this right. Didn't I share dismay?
There has to be some type of dismay in your life to be reasonably and morally responsible, to understand the right from wrong.
Maybe a father died and it can happen at any part of your life.
It doesn't have to be early on. It doesn't have to be late. We could sit here and we can say, okay, this guy has been a dirtball all his life. Well, guess what? Constantine basically was and became a saint, but he wasn't a good guy.
Not until the end, until he repented.
[01:01:46] Speaker B: What about Paul? Who was before he was Paul? He was Saul.
[01:01:51] Speaker A: That's right.
[01:01:52] Speaker B: And he persecuted christians.
[01:01:55] Speaker A: Exactly.
[01:01:57] Speaker B: Was met on the road, I think, if I remember the story correctly, with a blinding light of some sort. And it blinded him, right? Am I right? Am I thinking the right one?
[01:02:08] Speaker A: Yes, you are.
[01:02:10] Speaker B: And it blinded him. And God spoke to him, or Christ spoke to him and said, why are you persecuting me? And basically opened his spiritual eyes up to what he was doing prior to know. Again, it's similar to what we were talking about with Adam and Eve. They didn't know any better. He thought he was doing the right thing by persecuting the christians. He thought that was the jewish thing to do, go after these people.
And God opened up his spiritual eyes and he said, you're not going to be Saul anymore. Now we're going to call you Paul. And he was a dirtbag, man. I mean, he murdered people, right?
[01:02:47] Speaker A: Yes, he did. Matter of fact, when he got yelled at, he was knocked off of his foal, the donkey. He was not.
Why? Why are you persecuting me? And then blinded, remember? He was blinded too, until he ran into who he was supposed to run into, one of the apostles. Now all of a sudden he got his sight back. Wow. Okay, now I see.
Not only do I not see, I understand it's a whole spiritual event that happened.
Yeah, you're absolutely 100% correct.
So people can change and they can repent at the last minute.
But if it were that easy that everyone could repent at the last minute, then my question would be, where is that moral responsibility at that point?
It'd be a free for all, wouldn't it?
[01:04:04] Speaker B: Yes. And who's to say you have a last minute? I had a situation happen to me at the end of August, the first week of September.
Didn't realize that I was bleeding internally and I had lost so much blood that I passed out. I didn't have any warning hey, you're about to pass out. I passed right out. So if I was someone who hadn't come to terms with God and accepted his son and his holy spirit, there wouldn't have been time for, oh God, please forgive me. There wouldn't have been any time for that because in one blink of an eye I was awake. In one blink of an eye I was out.
So who's to say you're going to get a last minute? You may. You may not.
[01:04:46] Speaker A: Right.
Using both of those experiences until that point. If it were a free for all, if it were a free for all for everybody, and there was no type of moral responsibility at all on this earth and nobody knew anything, they wouldn't know any better. They would just keep doing it. Right?
[01:05:11] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:05:12] Speaker A: So obviously we know. Okay, whoa, that doesn't feel right.
We all have that now, whether we listen to that or not, is that free will?
If you go and you beat somebody up for no reason at all, you're going to feel bad for that? I would hope.
But we have some people that don't.
I don't care if you're an atheist.
An atheist? You don't think an atheist couldn't feel bad? Maybe he's a guy that. Okay, I don't believe in Christ God, but I know that's wrong.
Or the Lutheran or the protestant or the Christian, the Catholic, Orthodox, doesn't matter.
So we then prove, okay, whether it's by C. S. Lewis, whether it's by the Tao or whatever, that there's almost like a karma, okay, if we do good, you can expect good.
And if we can expect good, then we must know that there is somebody that judges that.
So therefore there is a hierarchy there.
The person who makes the decrees, the laws, the commands and judges them alludes to a supreme being.
Now, regardless of what they call know God, Christ God, we know that that's there. There is a moral compass.
[01:07:21] Speaker B: That in itself had to come from somewhere, right?
[01:07:24] Speaker A: That's right. So that in itself would prove in more likelihood the existence of Christ God. And how can we base that? Well, we base that on Christ's character. Yeah, he got angry. He flipped the tables.
Okay, I remember when he got angry at the apostles because they were like, hey, put us at the right hand and the left hand of God. You don't know what you're asking.
You have no idea what you're asking for. And I cannot do that.
That is not for me to do.
So you see from Christ's actions, even though he is God in the flesh, he still had servitude for God, which then again proves that God exists.
[01:08:27] Speaker B: If you just look at something, one thing, just one thing, if you look at a human eye, it would be ridiculous to come at any other conclusion that that is intelligently designed that didn't just blow up one day and, oh, we're going to make an eye and we're going to make a hand. We're going to make a foot that was intelligently designed. And if it were intelligently designed, that means there is an intelligence behind everything that we experience, even the planet that we live on. I may be wrong, but I truly believe the planet that we live on is a living being of a sort.
[01:09:09] Speaker A: Oh, it's a living planet.
[01:09:11] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:09:13] Speaker A: Listen, it's all interconnected.
It's all interconnected. We're interconnected with all of it, and it's interconnected with us, and we are ruled by the one and only.
Because you can't have multiple gods.
We know that the astral.
[01:09:37] Speaker B: I disagree with you about as far as I can tell, there is more than one God. That's why we say God, who the jews sometimes refer to as Jehovah or other names.
[01:09:50] Speaker A: Yahweh.
[01:09:50] Speaker B: Yahweh is the God above all gods because the Bible says that there is a God of the fallen world, and that's Satan. So there is more than one God. It's just that the God that we serve is the highest of all of them. There's nobody above him.
[01:10:09] Speaker A: The one true God.
[01:10:11] Speaker B: Amen.
[01:10:12] Speaker A: That's it. It's the one true God.
I am.
I am the one and only true God, the Lord your God.
He's very distinct in how he puts know and he's done it numerous times. I am. That was the other reason after watching the video of Kenneth Copeland where he claims that, oh, yeah, because God's here. I am.
He uses it and I'm thinking, this guy is just missing horns and a spear in his tail.
We have so many false prophets and teachers and everything. But it's very interesting.
[01:11:01] Speaker B: Yeah, I just happened to look him up while you're talking. That's the guy. And he was the one that I saw on a video being interviewed about his aircraft and the look that he gave. Oh, my gosh. Oh, my.
[01:11:15] Speaker A: And then he led on others in Nigeria, he led on others in Africa and many other preachers who give money today. Give this today and you will reap so many fold. Look at the stock market. They don't get 100% return. You will. And I'm thinking you can't buy God.
You can't buy your way into heaven, not even by the deeds that you do.
You will be judged.
But it's your belief in God, and it's your wholeheartedness, your love about him, his son, and the belief in his son and what he did for us.
There is no other way. You cannot bargain. We will not be able to bargain. We will not be able to sell.
We will not be able to do a thing to get us one step, 1ft, one inch closer.
And God says, I will choose who I will have mercy on and who I won't have mercy on. We know this.
For who I have compassion, I will have compassion. For I have mercy. I will have mercy.
[01:12:42] Speaker B: Amen.
[01:12:48] Speaker A: I want you to join me again while we do this. I know we ran a little over, and that's okay, but because I think it's important to put God on trial. Not that we're putting him on trial, but trying to prove in his existence so that people can see. Okay, listen.
We have tried every which way we want to have a relationship with God, but we want to have it on our terms. We don't want to. And today, as we were reading, it was very funny.
You get into these lulls, and I. And I call them lulls. Even I do.
And I'm reading and I'm loving all the stories and trying to look at them in a whole different perspective. Now, going back to Joseph.
The dream that Joseph had at the end was he ended up second in charge under Pharaoh because he stored the food during the seven good years. And during the seven years of famine, he gave out the food and everything. And Pharaoh actually made out kind of like a bandit.
But the truth of it was his brothers did come, and they did end up bowing to him. And he said, listen, don't worry about you selling me into slavery.
I see what the dream is now. I understand it now. So I wasn't needling you. It goes back. This is the reunification with his brothers, okay? Where he comes back and he says, if you hadn't done what you did, I wouldn't have been able to save so many lives in Egypt and throughout the land.
What you did was good.
It had to be that way.
So even if he was needling them, let's say he was needling his brothers a little bit. I had this dream, and you're all going to bow before me. Or was it. I had a dream, and it's read, and you're all bowing down and I'm standing tall. I don't know what it means he didn't put it that way. So could his brothers have honestly believed that maybe he was needling them a little bit? Maybe, but maybe not. But at the end, he knew what that dream was. And he says to him, listen, don't feel bad for what happened, what transpired.
It was good. It was done for good.
It saved lives.
How many millions, we don't know.
But because of the way he interpreted the dreams, and even when he was in prison, he interpreted the dreams, if you remember, of the baker and the servant for Pharaoh, he put them both in prison and they both had this dream. And he said, you will come out of prison, you will be judged. You will be speared through and hung.
Boom, it happened. And the other one, he said, you're going to be restored back and hand the cup to Pharaoh.
Boom, it happened.
And all the magicians and all the magic acts and everything, nobody can interpret Pharaoh's dreams.
But Joseph was able to tell him, hey, your dreams, here it is. You're going to have seven good years of plenty, good crop and everything else, and then you're going to go through a famine.
And he says, you're going to have to put somebody in charge to prepare for this. And Pharaoh said, I just did. It's you.
You're the only one that could read the dream. Why am I going to put anybody else in charge? Here's my ring. Takes off his ring, gives it to him, parades him around the chariots behind him. You will all listen to him. You will all answer to him.
He just came out of prison.
[01:16:56] Speaker B: Yes.
[01:16:57] Speaker A: And he was wrongfully put in prison. Why? Because the captain, the guard, his wife kept hitting on him. And he said, listen, I'm not going to do this. I'm the second in charge of the captain of the guard and everything underneath him. I am not going to go against God.
I'm not going to do this. And he runs out of there and leaves his garment there. And she lies and has him put in prison. But even in prison, he ends up on top and helps many people in there.
So God had a reason to plan everything.
[01:17:33] Speaker B: That goes to show you God is in your corner. That's right. When it all looks hopeless, there's still an unbelievable outcome.
Like you mentioned, the king was told that he was trying to make it with his wife when it was the other way around. His wife was actually the one after him. And I think the last encounter, if I remember correctly, he literally ran out of the house. He ran out of wherever they were. He ran out and said, I can't do this. That's not me. And out of that devotion he suffered, he went to prison. But look at the outcome. The outcome would if somebody was being told a story and they would go, well, that's the end of that guy.
Next time we see him, it'll be when he's getting ready to be put six foot under because he's in prison. And prison back then wasn't. You think prison is bad today?
It's a walk in the park in some places compared to the prisons that they had back then, it was hell.
[01:18:37] Speaker A: But when you go through it, not that we have the right as mankind to put God's character at the test, but we see God's character at the test because he's the one that puts it to light.
Listen, we saw this. We go back and we see that with Aaron.
And Aaron's sons, they put too much incense and presented it in the tabernacle. God killed them right away.
[01:19:09] Speaker B: Wow.
[01:19:09] Speaker A: And Aaron is the priest, right? And his sons, they're major players. And he said, listen, you will follow everything as I tell you because I am the most holy. It is the most holy thing.
And they didn't. So there were consequences to it. And he lost his two sons and he had to live with that.
And remember, Aaron also made his mistakes too. While Moses was up in the mount, he took everybody's gold and jewelry and everything like that. And what mold a calf.
And God turned and said, go for me. Now I see what the people are down there. They have made a molten calf as a God to pray to.
I'm going to go down and destroy them all. And Moses turns and says, don't do this. Please don't do this. You just brought them all out of Egypt.
Don't show the Egyptians or anybody else that this is a waste.
And so then God, it says repented because of Moses. Moses goes down there, he sees it, 5000 debt. Okay.
He goes down there and he sees it.
Okay, I'll take care of this.
[01:20:56] Speaker B: Wow.
[01:20:58] Speaker A: Very interesting. But if you read the text and you don't get into it philosophically, but you look at it completely outside the box and the drama of it all and look at it from a different perspective, and the Bible is so open to interpretation. I'm not a preacher, I'm not a pastor. I'm nobody.
I just like to read it and read it and share it with people on here. But I think it is important in today's world that we do this.
This is one of the things that actually I want to write about. Because as we go through life, I've seen this now, and it's real simple for me, okay? How can I put God on trial and at the same time prove I'm on the side of proving his existence? And I haven't even gotten into our own. You did a little bit with the passing out, but those things that we experience, too. And that's why I'd love to have you back next week, if you could, so that we could kind of finish up and then we'll get back. Yeah, and then I want to get back into some different readings and stuff like that.
Enoch's a wonderful story, Elijah. There's so many wonderful books to go through.
But I think it's important to do that, to give people hope. To give people faith.
What is hope? What is faith?
[01:22:42] Speaker B: Is there a difference?
For me, it's the knowing. You know that. You know that. You know, I use the analogy of, I know I had parents the same way I know that there was a Christ and that he lived and died and was sacrificed for my personal well being.
[01:23:00] Speaker A: The faith to me is believing and acknowledging and knowing in something that I can't possibly see and in my own existence. But I know it's to be true.
The hope goes along with the faith because we hope that that is true. But we have the faith to know it's true.
So that carries us on, which leads down the line to our moral responsibility.
[01:23:42] Speaker B: I had a pastor tell me one time, this pastor told me, if you have faith in God like you have faith in the brakes on your car, your life will be a heck of a lot easier. You'll have a lot better understanding. And when you're driving your car, you don't think about, are my brakes going to work? Do I believe my brakes are going to work? You know your brakes are going to work. It's the same thing that. The analogy that he gave me. If people had the faith in God that they have in their brakes on their car, then their lives would be fulfilled much greater than wherever they're at at this point in their life. Because they would know. Like I mentioned earlier, they would know that they know that they know that they know.
[01:24:23] Speaker A: Yes, exactly.
It's a truth.
It's a truth to it also.
Okay, I'm going to tap that break. It is going to stop me.
[01:24:37] Speaker B: So when I say this prayer, I know that God is going to hear me. It's not that I believe God's going to hear me. I know that God is going to hear me. When I say this prayer now. Whether he answers my request or not is another story. That's up to him. But knowing that he hears you, that's important.
[01:24:57] Speaker A: It's believing, too.
Not just knowing, believing. I know God can hear me, but am I reasonable enough and have I been reasonable and moral enough to know that he will hear me?
Because we could fall on deaf ears, understand?
If we are corrupt, if we're not obedient and everything else, we've seen it in the Bible, it's fallen on deaf ears because they continue to do this.
God goes as far and tells them, you're a stiff necked people.
What is your problem?
I have made your life. I have proven to you over and over again, and still you don't want to follow my commands.
My ordinances have obedience and fall away from me. And yet at the same time, he was still there. Letting him come back and come back again when they pleaded to them.
It's very interesting.
[01:26:20] Speaker B: Yep.
[01:26:21] Speaker A: But it goes to God's character and it goes to Christ's character.
And we'll talk more about that next week. Definitely talk more about that. I can't. Thank you again for tuning in with me because really, I can't do this by myself.
I have to have another set of shoes to help keep me.
Am I being reasonable?
[01:26:49] Speaker B: I think so.
[01:26:51] Speaker A: Am I being moral?
Just because it feels moral doesn't mean that it is moral.
[01:26:58] Speaker B: Yeah. It's an honor and a privilege to have the opportunity to be on with you, my friend. We'll look forward to it next week.
[01:27:04] Speaker A: Absolutely. Listen, I want to thank you all for tuning into life. Walk with Christ, God.
Take that time. Just take a little bit of time.
You have to come to your own conclusions.
This isn't something that somebody tells you and then, okay, I'm going to believe. No, it's not something that you can just believe. You can know all the words inside out in the Bible, every verse, everything like that. Doesn't make a guarantee that you will get into heaven.
Satan knows the Bible better than all.
[01:27:43] Speaker B: Just remember, hell accepts everybody. Heaven, there has to be a prerequisite.
[01:27:49] Speaker A: There is a gate.
There is a gate.
[01:27:55] Speaker B: All right, buddy.
[01:27:56] Speaker A: All right.
[01:27:56] Speaker B: Thank you. Thank you, man.
[01:27:58] Speaker A: God bless, brother.
Good night, all. Thank you for tuning in. Up next on Trim radio network, we are going to have money and change with the wonderful, the great Stu shear. So don't go away, folks, because we're going to be right back in just about 20 minutes. And we're going to turn on money and change with Stu Shear. With that, I want you to have a wonderful week and take the time.
If there's something missing, if there's something lacking, if there's something that's going on in your life that you can't figure out, you don't know how to figure out, don't look to your own self. I'll figure this out. It doesn't work that way. We are all reliant, I promise you.
But you can be part of the greatest team there is.
Christ, God's team.
Just take a look. Explore.
The Bible is open to so many different interpretations. It's open to interpretation, reproach. But you know what?
It's a great basic instruction before leaving Earth and get a different perspective because it can make so many changes for you.
If you have any problems with that, call me, message me, email me. I'm always open and I don't have the answers. I'm not a pastor, I'm not a preacher, I'm not a bishop, I'm not a rabbi, I'm not anything.
I'm just somebody that is just like you.
And with that, God bless. Take care. We'll see you next week. Bye.
